formula40pc
Member
I am going to down size from my 45 to a 40 PC and would like to get some feedback on the IPS drive system. Looking at 40's between 2006 and 2008, would like to know what to look for or look out for.
Opinions on 2006 to 2008 IPS
- Thread starter formula40pc
- Start date
formula40pc
Member
I'm a little surprised and disappointed nobody with IPS has offered any insight on the topic. Since Formula has offered this on the larger boats since '06 I'm sure there are plenty of owners unless all are extremely happy and have no info to offer. My reason for asking is that I am looking at 40 pc's with IPS once I sell my '07-45. Looking forward to some feedback.
boatweiser
New member
A couple of thoughts - the IPS forum is BRAND NEW - notice yours is the only thread! Drop this same topic under Sport Yachts and you will get more bites. With that said I have never had an IPS boat but I did have a Zeus SR. There will be lots of technical conversation I am sure, starting with since you are going to look at earlier generations keep an ey out to make sure the software upgrades and any recall upgrades to hardware have been done. Like any new technology the current versions are much better than the originals. However these systems are programmable so you can make 1st and 2nd gen's better.
As for boating experience? Faster, better fuel mileage and easy to make you look like a stud in the tightest quarters - what's not to like?! I can say I easily handled a 470 SR as solo all the time because the stick makes it so easy..... If you can look for a boat with the DPS - its standard with Zeus, an expensive option on IPS but worth it.
As for boating experience? Faster, better fuel mileage and easy to make you look like a stud in the tightest quarters - what's not to like?! I can say I easily handled a 470 SR as solo all the time because the stick makes it so easy..... If you can look for a boat with the DPS - its standard with Zeus, an expensive option on IPS but worth it.
formula40pc
Member
Thank you for your input.
Don't own one so can't talk about maintenance but did just take a ride for a long weekend from Stuart FL to West End Bahamas and then to Green Turtle Cay and back. Was on a 42 Cruiser with IPS. Boat ran solid. What was really cool is the system maintains engine RPM even when climbing up the back of a 10 foot swell! You could hear the engines spool up to maintain speed and just as we crested they dropped right back to set engine RPM.
Depending on where you boat can make a big difference in your decision to go with IPS. I do a lot of shallow/river running and I don't really worry about the tide! A friend of mine went from I/O to IPS. His 1st season he touched bottom 2x's trying to go where he used to go. Since them he is now limited to where he can go and a what tide. Granted, I am talking shallow up river running. In the back bays and in most inland waterways you should be fine. Just something else to think about.
Most efficient to least
I/O
IPS
Inboard
In my opinion most expensive if grounded to least
IPS
Inboard
I/O (only because the drives will release and pop up if hit hard)
Depending on where you boat can make a big difference in your decision to go with IPS. I do a lot of shallow/river running and I don't really worry about the tide! A friend of mine went from I/O to IPS. His 1st season he touched bottom 2x's trying to go where he used to go. Since them he is now limited to where he can go and a what tide. Granted, I am talking shallow up river running. In the back bays and in most inland waterways you should be fine. Just something else to think about.
Most efficient to least
I/O
IPS
Inboard
In my opinion most expensive if grounded to least
IPS
Inboard
I/O (only because the drives will release and pop up if hit hard)
boatweiser
New member
Admin
no question a POD will add some draft - but man if 6" is the difference where you are running you have a pair I don't! With that said your are right on with your 'cost to damage' analysis as a result of draught. I picked up a boarding mat in my marina some careless neighbor let blow off his boat (truth be told I am pretty sure it was mine but I didn't tell the insurance guys that!). Point being the extra draught had me close enough to the bottom that I wrapped the mat and did $24k worth of damage to the pod and tranny.
INTERESTINGLY, and this applies to all modern boats that are now 'fly by wire', I never noticed any issues with the boats performance and attitude! NO vibration, NO loss of performance...NOTHING. but I was getting alarms and high coolant temps. Had techs on the boat multiple times to check for leaks, coolant issues, anything. Always came up empty. Finally after running her for probably 10 hours over a couple of outings I got a vibration that would shake a train. I immediately jumped under the boat and found a rats nest about 4' around the pod bound up in her tight as could be.
Point being I asked the techs from Cummings and Merc why it took so long to 'feel' the prop issue. They both communicated that was because the steering and the throttles were not actually connected to the props/pods. A downside to the hi tech boating that is out there now.
I have some pics that I will share when I find them!
no question a POD will add some draft - but man if 6" is the difference where you are running you have a pair I don't! With that said your are right on with your 'cost to damage' analysis as a result of draught. I picked up a boarding mat in my marina some careless neighbor let blow off his boat (truth be told I am pretty sure it was mine but I didn't tell the insurance guys that!). Point being the extra draught had me close enough to the bottom that I wrapped the mat and did $24k worth of damage to the pod and tranny.
INTERESTINGLY, and this applies to all modern boats that are now 'fly by wire', I never noticed any issues with the boats performance and attitude! NO vibration, NO loss of performance...NOTHING. but I was getting alarms and high coolant temps. Had techs on the boat multiple times to check for leaks, coolant issues, anything. Always came up empty. Finally after running her for probably 10 hours over a couple of outings I got a vibration that would shake a train. I immediately jumped under the boat and found a rats nest about 4' around the pod bound up in her tight as could be.
Point being I asked the techs from Cummings and Merc why it took so long to 'feel' the prop issue. They both communicated that was because the steering and the throttles were not actually connected to the props/pods. A downside to the hi tech boating that is out there now.
I have some pics that I will share when I find them!
formula40pc
Member
Very interesting info on the delay of "feeling" an issue. Was unaware of that.
bamastones
New member
I have a 2012 45 with D6 IPS. Absolutely love this package. Easy to handle, easy to dock in any weather / wind / current conditions, and good fuel mileage. I have 250hrs without any major issues related to the IPS. I have mine professionally maintained and treat them well. my girls (11 and 14) love to dock the boat and pull it out of the slip - they look at it like any other electronic device. The boat tracks extremely well in bad conditions - 4-6' seas are not a problem at all and I have been in 8' + more than once without any cavitation / shuddering / tracking issues. I feel very confident with the engines and pods. There is no exhaust issue and no exhaust streaks to clean off the sides of the hull. very quiet and clean running because of the through-pod exhaust.
As far as the grounding issues - I stay in the channels. Any 40-45 foot boat that runs aground, wraps a line / etc. can get major damage and in my mind is based on the speed of impact and not the type of running gear. If I don't have 3 feet under me, I don't go. Just my comfort level. Too expensive a boat to go anywhere with anything less.
At this point, I would not consider a boat like this without the IPS system.
As far as the grounding issues - I stay in the channels. Any 40-45 foot boat that runs aground, wraps a line / etc. can get major damage and in my mind is based on the speed of impact and not the type of running gear. If I don't have 3 feet under me, I don't go. Just my comfort level. Too expensive a boat to go anywhere with anything less.
At this point, I would not consider a boat like this without the IPS system.
twarble
Member
formula40pc,
sorry...just found this area of the forum! thanks to GSENT for putting it on there! so much going on with IPS...great to have a place to chat.
first things first. i love this setup. we boat A LOT!!! i purchased an '08 in June of 2011 with 87 hours on it. it now has over 1300 on it, and we've done something like 1500nm since last June alone!
i agree with bamastones that it's the best setup out there. even my dad takes the helm from time to time, and he's scared to death of this boat.
very easy to handle with minimal input. then again, i'm part of the early video game generation and it comes somewhat natural. don't think i'd ever get away from it though.
also, my experience in moving from a 40PC with the Yanmar 440HP v-drives to the 45Y with the IPS D6-435 engines is that the IPS is more fuel efficient, runs 1-2kts faster and the boat weighs twice as much. crazy if you ask me.
i'm guessing if you look around on the Yachts forum, you'll see lots of posts from me on pod issues. a few things i'd think about before getting into them...they're forward facing props. if you're in skinny water, or debris laden water like i am, you're going to hit stuff if you're not careful, so get used to swapping props. that being said, i just had to learn that i couldn't get on plane the day after a really nasty t-storm when you could see debris. like i said, we're obsessed about getting out. nowadays, we go slow the day after a storm. no biggie. we also have 2 spare sets of props which i keep ready to go if i need to do a quick swap. like i said...obsessed.
the other thing that happened back then was they were using a lesser material as part of the seal between the pod, and the body of the boat. if you're in the engine compartment, and you look down at the pod, you'll see a big ring around the pod. you can't see the seal, but they had a tendency to fail back then due to corrosion. i can't remember what material they were using, and what they moved to, but it's a good question to ask if the previous owner had it fixed if you're looking at a used boat. if the seal fails, that means sea water in your transmission oil. that leads to really nasty things...and if not caught, pod failure. look for milky transmission oil...looks like chocolate milk if there are any leaks, but there are a number of seals that could do this.
third...they started off with a sea strainer that was mounted high, and to the port side of each engine forward. unfortunately, it was really easy to cross thread the cap when you put it back on, and the cap would leak only when the boat was running. this means you would start the engines and see no leaks, and then when you're running sea water would run down your engine. look at both the forward port side engine mounts as they can corrode really quick. also, on my boat, the house alternator is mounted on the port engine, forward and to port. mine froze solid due to this, and the house/windlass batteries suffered/died. having the sea strainer relocated is not a big deal...i believe this is even a recall. but you don't want rusted engine mounts and a bad alternator.
the last thing is a nit pick, but they've upgraded the oil cooler for the pod transmission. see if that's been upgraded. not a big deal if not, but i've been told that the D6-435-D/A pod on the 45Y is undersized for that size boat...pushing the limits at least. i'm guessing the 40 with it's much lower weight is good to go. long story, but i'm running one of each pod with the different cooler's, and it runs great.
finally...just check all of the anodes. there are some on the inside of the exhaust tunnels of the pods. if you're good here, that's a great sign.
hope this helps. happy shopping, and post some pics if you pull the trigger! if i wasn't clear earlier...i posted some things to watch out for, but i'd totally do it again.
tw
sorry...just found this area of the forum! thanks to GSENT for putting it on there! so much going on with IPS...great to have a place to chat.
first things first. i love this setup. we boat A LOT!!! i purchased an '08 in June of 2011 with 87 hours on it. it now has over 1300 on it, and we've done something like 1500nm since last June alone!
i agree with bamastones that it's the best setup out there. even my dad takes the helm from time to time, and he's scared to death of this boat.
very easy to handle with minimal input. then again, i'm part of the early video game generation and it comes somewhat natural. don't think i'd ever get away from it though.also, my experience in moving from a 40PC with the Yanmar 440HP v-drives to the 45Y with the IPS D6-435 engines is that the IPS is more fuel efficient, runs 1-2kts faster and the boat weighs twice as much. crazy if you ask me.
i'm guessing if you look around on the Yachts forum, you'll see lots of posts from me on pod issues. a few things i'd think about before getting into them...they're forward facing props. if you're in skinny water, or debris laden water like i am, you're going to hit stuff if you're not careful, so get used to swapping props. that being said, i just had to learn that i couldn't get on plane the day after a really nasty t-storm when you could see debris. like i said, we're obsessed about getting out. nowadays, we go slow the day after a storm. no biggie. we also have 2 spare sets of props which i keep ready to go if i need to do a quick swap. like i said...obsessed.
the other thing that happened back then was they were using a lesser material as part of the seal between the pod, and the body of the boat. if you're in the engine compartment, and you look down at the pod, you'll see a big ring around the pod. you can't see the seal, but they had a tendency to fail back then due to corrosion. i can't remember what material they were using, and what they moved to, but it's a good question to ask if the previous owner had it fixed if you're looking at a used boat. if the seal fails, that means sea water in your transmission oil. that leads to really nasty things...and if not caught, pod failure. look for milky transmission oil...looks like chocolate milk if there are any leaks, but there are a number of seals that could do this.
third...they started off with a sea strainer that was mounted high, and to the port side of each engine forward. unfortunately, it was really easy to cross thread the cap when you put it back on, and the cap would leak only when the boat was running. this means you would start the engines and see no leaks, and then when you're running sea water would run down your engine. look at both the forward port side engine mounts as they can corrode really quick. also, on my boat, the house alternator is mounted on the port engine, forward and to port. mine froze solid due to this, and the house/windlass batteries suffered/died. having the sea strainer relocated is not a big deal...i believe this is even a recall. but you don't want rusted engine mounts and a bad alternator.
the last thing is a nit pick, but they've upgraded the oil cooler for the pod transmission. see if that's been upgraded. not a big deal if not, but i've been told that the D6-435-D/A pod on the 45Y is undersized for that size boat...pushing the limits at least. i'm guessing the 40 with it's much lower weight is good to go. long story, but i'm running one of each pod with the different cooler's, and it runs great.
finally...just check all of the anodes. there are some on the inside of the exhaust tunnels of the pods. if you're good here, that's a great sign.
hope this helps. happy shopping, and post some pics if you pull the trigger! if i wasn't clear earlier...i posted some things to watch out for, but i'd totally do it again.
tw
formula40pc
Member
twarble, Thnx for the Input. Very informative, Haven't alot of action on my sale lately, everyone wants to trade a 37 or they have to sell first.
i have been looking at a 40 pc with ips as well ...from my research I can confirm what twarble says ...
I have become fast friends with a regional Volvo ips engineer and he says
top 3 things are
1. steering rings on each pod .. needs to be stainless and not nimbral
2. oil cooling upgrade .. ths is actuall pretty important as the original " gen 1 " oil cooling is not up to par providing only 30% correct cooling .. after upgrade its more towards 90%
these 2 upgrade cost in the range of 15- 20k to perform .. so be sure its done already or use that number to negotiate as these should be done ..
lastly he said that the pod shaft seals should be changed annually on each pod when the oil is changed ... this is to ensure that they do not fail .. now the problem with that is it requires special Volvo tech tools to do which we don't have .. but he says its an easy thing..
I like to do my own basic servicing and this is the only step that I cannot complete on my own ..
hope this helps ..
I have become fast friends with a regional Volvo ips engineer and he says
top 3 things are
1. steering rings on each pod .. needs to be stainless and not nimbral
2. oil cooling upgrade .. ths is actuall pretty important as the original " gen 1 " oil cooling is not up to par providing only 30% correct cooling .. after upgrade its more towards 90%
these 2 upgrade cost in the range of 15- 20k to perform .. so be sure its done already or use that number to negotiate as these should be done ..
lastly he said that the pod shaft seals should be changed annually on each pod when the oil is changed ... this is to ensure that they do not fail .. now the problem with that is it requires special Volvo tech tools to do which we don't have .. but he says its an easy thing..
I like to do my own basic servicing and this is the only step that I cannot complete on my own ..
hope this helps ..
I am an IT security engineer and I really fell in love with the idea of IPS, easy of docking . better handling, technology, speed, fuel savings etc ...I would love to own one but I realize from my extensive research that there is so much that can go wrong. I have seen the service records and price tags when things do go wrong and its in the 10's of thousands a pop ... not a pretty sight ..
its tough because im torn on I/o simplicity as opposed to newer technology...
its tough because im torn on I/o simplicity as opposed to newer technology...
formula40pc
Member
xrayg. Thanks for the info. was aware of the ring and cooling but not the seal replacement each year. is that tool available for purchase or is there a pic of it that you know of. Thnx.