New Resto Project...'79 255 Liberator

[sprink49]

Some how...I had the fortune of discovering a '79 255 Liberator here in South Florida...that has been in salt water twice!!!

This gem was brought down from the UP of Michigan where it originated. The boat was kept inside in the winter and trailered in the summers...fresh water only. The owner is one of a priviledged few that owns lake property in Northern Michigan and a water front home in Ft. Lauderdale. He brought the 255 down 2 years ago but lost interest in it when he aquired a larger boat as well as a center console sport fisherman. The Liberator sat around in a storage lot and was put up for sale. With the economy being in the tank...boat sales have been the worst ever so this beauty just weathered outside. Long story short, I've always had a thing for Liberators but haven't seen one around here in years. I saw the boat for sale...went and had a look...moved out of the F-26 project and made a deal.

Here are the details: My 255 is all white with a blue interior. Power is 2; Mercruiser 260's on No 1 drives. My best available documentation has the engines as new long blocks in 2005 with Edelbrock Performer intakes beneath fresh Q-Jets. The drives are new in 2006 for the port drive and rebuilt starboard in 2006. It was shot in white Imron about 10 years ago and after a wash down today with Or-Pine wash & wax with a quick polish job by hand with car polish the hull looks NEW. The interior is about a 6.5 with a hodge podge of bolster buckets (that I can't figure out how to put together).

For reasons that escape me, there are still those people out there that re-model boat interiors that believe that construction and automotive grade hardware will hold up in a marine enviroment....NOT. So I have some re-work to do...no big deal...I never liked white painted masonite Bead Board anyway (I'm not kidding).

I also got a recent professionally made Bimini Top with complete Eisenglass wrap around including a full rear drape to the transom...made of Sunbrella....plus a full Sunbrella cockpit cover!!! I have to say this: There are GROWN MEN doing custom canvas work in the UP of Michigan that the rest of the country (especially South Florida) in that business can learn much from!!

I spent today cleaning and figuring out what I have. i still am amazed every time I crawl through these old Formulas that have had a little reasonable care...they just hold up and turn heads 31 years later!!

The starboard U Joint bellows is split, I have a starter problem starboard engine...does anyone know if these boats use a "slave" solonoid for the starting circuit for each engine...if so where is it located? Has anyone done any business with Mcleod...the interior suppliers for Formula? Any thoughts on other replacement seating?

I'm on my way with this one...all comments and suggestions welcome.

 

[wdp1227]

She's a BEAUTY! Where in So Fla? I have not been on one but I imagine your interest.

I do my boating in fresh water, northern NY, but long to have something in east coast south Florida to tootle with, that is rock solid like my ole 1970 233.

 

[sprink49]

Re: New Resto Project...'79 255 Liberator...UPDATE

We are now at the re-power stage. Tired 260's are being replaced by a pair of strong Vortec Roller Motors. I have made a serious decision to move up from Alpha/Merc No 1 drives to Bravo I's. The old 260's are out and the 2008 Bravo Transom assemblies complete with rams, cables, hoses and pumps are on the truck from Texas...should get them next week. I debated whether or not to go Bravo or stay with Alphas. I kept looking at those dyno sheets...365 horse at 5200 and 435 ft lbs at 3200. I also thought about the 60 miles of open ocean I run between West Palm and Freeport/Lucaya...Bravo reliability and ability to handle the shock loads wins. I'm not running around in an inland lake and need the peace of mind.

This old 'bird is about to get a serious kick in the ass!!

New Engines:

Old 260's coming out:

Dirty Bilge

Clean 33 year old bilge ready for Transom assembly removal and rigging....waiting on 2: Bravo Transom assemblies. This is the only boat I have owned that has a full gel coated bilge...made clean up a lot easier.

The Formula 255 Lib on New all American 10200 lb Twin Torsion Disc Brake Trailer.

Next is template drill of 2: additional holes for the Bravo Transom Assemblies, install same along with new trim pumps, bilge pump and plumbing, bilge blowers and plumbing.

2008 Bravo Transom Assemblies arrived this past week from Boatman22 in Texas...thanks Tom...they look NEW.

Meanwhile...Engines are being set up with all of the brackets and accessories from the 260's that are worthy. Then we paint every thing. I am still engineering the exhaust and cooling. At this point we are leaning towards aluminum Hi Po manifolds through the Bravo Y pipes. I am still undecided on whether to pull raw water through hull or through the drives.

I am going to be seriously looking for a pair of Bravo I drives soon.

I spent time this weekend removing old things like bilge blowers and bilge pumps that are being replaced as well as drive trim pumps. I spent about $50 on zip ties and clips at Wards Marine Electric...just part of the deal. Once you get into one of these restoration projects you find yourself saying "might as well" a lot!!

I can see it all coming together now. Cant wait to get this classic back in the water.

Stay tuned...

 

[boathound]

Nice job!

 

[sprink49]

OK...found my Bravo I Drives in Sarasota. I am headed over one day this week to pick them up. I finished painting both engines this week end...they were bare metal so I primed with Zinc Chromate and finished with 2 coats of Mercruiser Phantom Black. I coated the aluminum intakes with acrylic clear to seal them.

I haven't finalized the exhaust yet but I am seriously considering the GLM Aluminum manifolds and risers with "Triple exhaust" thru hull and Y-Pipe from Dennis Moore.

http://www.mooreperformance.info/TripleExhaustPipes.html

Looks like this may be the way I go.

stay tuned...

 

[Formula Tenn]

are you getting a pair with one of them being counter rotating?

 

[sprink49]

are you getting a pair with one of them being counter rotating?

Well I am getting a pair and they both have been gone through with very recent low hours. As I understand Bravo I drives, reverse rotation is as simple as reversing the shift mechanism to flip the shift at the drive. There is no "right or left rotation Bravo...they can go either way. That being said I may decide to spin the port side left to even things out and direct the thrust a bit more. I have spoken to those who have done it that like it so I say why not if it's no big deal.

 

[sprink49]

OK..got the Bravo transom assemblies in. I used a Mercruiser Template to locate and drill the two additional holes for the Bravo's.

Next...drop in the Vortec 355's...stay tuned.

 

[Larrys PC 27]

Any updates and new pics????? ???

 

[sprink49]

Been working in the Bilge between working long hours and busy at home. New bilge pump and blowers, hoses, wiring,etc. Installed replacement thru hulls for vents and pump discharge. Accessories going on both engines.

Finally got all new custom tempered glass and replacing it as well.

Looks like July before I'm on the water...this stuff takes time when you do it yourself.

Stay Tuned.

 

[Larrys PC 27]

Any updates or PICs ???

 

[SeaSkip]

Any updates or PICs ???

OK, I wasn't watching this thread, but now I am thanks to the bump brought about by your question.

 

[sprink49]

The boat and motors are in the same building now. We have run the engines and are making a few changes.I was able to get some Dyno time and was very pleased with the results.....Horsepower peaked at 422@5600 and Torque was 451@4200. The Torque numbers tell the story and we had 400# plus from 2600 thru 5400. The 'sweet spot" is 4400 RPM with 375 HP and 450# of TQ. Think about 750 HP and 900 # TQ in a 5600# boat at 4400 RPM. The prop selection will start with a 23" mirage Plus and I think that will be close to right for this set up. That should put top speed right at 65~70 @5500 RPM and cruise 55~60 @4500. Rev limiters will be set at 5800...for those times that the props leave the water!!

The exhaust used for the Dyno pulls was a pair of tuned headers. I will be running stock exhaust so we figure to loose about 20~25 HP on the top due to the inherent inefficiencies of a stock system at higher RPM. I'm not too concerned about the horsepower numbers...the torque numbers are more meaningful in a Marine application.

The power/torque numbers are strong. Vortec heads and Roller Cams/Lifters have changed the game with Small Block Chevy's. Back in the day we had to run radical cams and super high compression to get these numbers and the RPM was above 6000. These engines in this boat will have great "Dock Manners" and will run very well with out running them at high RPM constantly.

SuperFlow
Dynomometers and Flow Benches
SF-902S

355 MARINE CHEVROLET Result Summary Date 12-20-2012 1:46 PM Temp 80 Deg F. RH 74%

RPM TQ* HP*
2600 399 198
2800 408 218
3000 421 240
3200 430 262
3400 436 282
3600 440 302
3800 444 321
4000 448 341
4200 451 361
4400 450 377
4600 443 388
4800 438 401
5000 431 410
5200 421 416
5400 409 421
5600 396 422
5800 373 411
Max 452 422
Avg 426 339

* Test Exhaust 1.5" Diameter Dyno Tester Supplied Headers.

355-cid VORTEC SPECS

Bore / Stroke / CID: 4.030 / 3.48 / 355 cid
Compression: 9.4:1
Block: GM factory four-bolt 350 L-31 VORTEC
Crank: SCAT forged-steel PN 1101-11133
Pistons: Probe forged (PN 130212334-030)
Rods: Probe (PN 1201-10062) 5.7"
Rings: Total Seal Moly
Bearings: Clevite
Gaskets: Mr. Gasket and GMPP
Cam: COMP Cams (XM264HR) 212/218 at .050, .488/.495 lift, 110 LS
Lifters: COMP (PN 875-16)
Chain: COMP (PN 2100)
Pushrods: COMP (PN 7372-16)
Rockers: COMP 1.5:1 (PN 1417-16)
Heads: GMPP Vortec (Scoggin-Dickey PN SD8060A)
Manifold: Edelbrock Performer RPM Air Gap (PN 7516)
Carb: Demon (PN 1402010VE)
Distributor: Davis Unified Ignition DUI-7000
Spark Plugs: Autolite AR103
Oil System: Milodon HV (pan PN 31505)

I sent my DUI marine distributors back to Davis Ignition in Memphis for some timing adjustments and now they are perfect. We are running initial set up on a pair of Marine Q-Jets and will be switching to a pair of Quick Fuel 750 CFM Mechanical Secondary Carburetors within a few weeks (That's what was used during the Dyno Testing).

I feel very good now about my decision to upgrade to Bravo I Drives.

Since my overall goal is durability as well as performance I decided to add oil coolers to the engines to make sure things stay cool. We are going thru the process of plumbing and mounting the coolers as well as a pair of engine flush inlets.

I have one very good Bravo I drive and am waiting on the re-build of another. I thought I had a good pair that I bought online but it turns out I bought 2: cases full of junk so that set me back a few weeks. Live and learn.

After the propulsion packages are dialed in it's time to move to the helm...all new gauges and a Garmin Chart Plotter. The McLeod drop out bolsters need to be installed and then I'm going to run this rig for a while. It's time to get on the water and enjoy this old girl!!

I met Grant porter of Formula a few weeks ago in Miami Beach at the Boat Show. I explained what I was doing and showed him some pictures. He was very interested and thanked me for my "Brand Loyalty". I promised to send him pictures of the 255 when I get finished....this one might be show cased in Formula Action or on the web site. It would be an honor.

 

[rjerisk]

I have been watching your project. I have the same boat.

 

[sprink49]

Well here is an update.

The engines are in, drives are on, all new wiring of the bilge has been completed, new engine harnesses, new bilge to helm harnesses, new steering cable and last but not least...all new gauges.

I got into a snag with clearances mounting the new Bravo Steering Ram on the traditional starboard side and had to relocate the steering set up and PS Pump to the Port side. There was then no way to connect the tillers with a linkage inside the bilge...so the external Tie Bar is now truly the only steering link between the two drives.

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The steering is very solid and tight even at high speeds. The boat performs very well...gets out of the hole and accelerates like an outboard. With over 800 Horsepower and 900# Ft of Torque, the acceleration is smooth and linear.

Over the next days and weeks I am reassembling the interior and fine tuning the whole boat with a new VHF Radio, Touch Screen Garmin GPS, and a serious Audio System.

Stay Tuned...

 

[SeaSkip]

The images are broken.

Photobucket returns 404 too. :-\

 

[sprink49]

Works for me.

 

[SeaSkip]

Works for me.

On the last set of images sent out? It works for me on the previous ones posted, but it's impossible that the last links work for you as the links aren't stored in the comment correctly. This is what I get from the last post with images:

 

[sprink49]

Summary to date

I have chronicled the restoration of this boat on the Formula Owners Forum...this will serve as a summary of the journey to date.

For some reason when i post pics to this forum from my Photobucket account they get posted at 25% of their original size. That only happens on this forum...but none of the others I am on.

Any way...

I have owned 3: Formulas prior to this one with the last being a '86 272 LS with twin 320 EFI SBC's on Alpha SS drives. I originally wanted to find and restore a '84-'86 272 but never could find the "right" boat. I have always admired the lines of the 255 Liberator so when this one became available I bought it.

The project boat is a 1979 Formula 255 Liberator that was built in the Decatur, IN plant ?a fact revealed by its HN prefix having the ?SGN? designation vs. ?TNR? which is the Miami plant designation for that decade. Signa Boat Co. was Vic Porters old Company that he merged with Thunderbird Formula when Fuqua industries took control in the ?70?s and Porter was president. Formula Deep V boats were built in Miami, Decatur, IL and Palo Alto, CA. The boat came to Ft. Lauderdale via Traverse City, MC around 2008 and I bought it in December 2010.. Some time in the early to mid ?90?s the engines were replaced with what I later found out were automotive long blocks?more on that later.

I bought the boat ?running with a very heavy home made steel trailer for $3500. After I purchased the boat I discovered that it had a bad gimbal bearing and transom assembly on the starboard side. I replaced the starboard TA with a good used one and ran the boat for about 6 months. It ran well enough?high 50?s..low 60?s depending on the load with 21? Stainless Cleavers. One afternoon I was cruising thru Pompano Beach in the ICW when I noticed the bilge pump running constantly?the water was hot!! I opened the hatch to find 4?-6? of hot water in the bilge and later found out that the port engine freeze plug above the starter had rusted through. That told me that I had automotive engines. Knowing that I was going to need to change all freeze plugs to brass and head gaskets to stainless on both engines, I pulled them both.

As things go sometimes with boats?I considered repowering while I had them both out. I kept my eye out for a pair of engines all the while educating myself as to the possibilities. I considered building 383 strokers from what I had but they were 2: bolt car blocks and lo flow truck heads. One night before bed I came across an ad in Craigslist for two 355 Vortec Roller Cam 4 bolt motors that were built by a reputable High Performance engine builder in Pompano Beach. These engines had been dynamometer tested at over 400 horsepower and were built for a client that never picked them up!!! I got up early and called the seller at 6 AM and met him at his shop at 9 AM. I saw the two engines and the parts list that went in them. These were long blocks with Marine Brass Lined intakes and no external accessories. They had built them under contract for an attorney for $10000?took a $5000 deposit and were asking $5K. I took them away for $4000 cash!!

OK?now I had two brand new 400 plus horse motors that none of my old accessories would fit?I had old ?Log? style exhaust that was used that I wasn?t going to put on these engines and my flywheels wouldn?t fit the new one piece rear main cranks. This meant that my pre Alpha bell housings wouldn?t work and I was looking at up grading everything to new style Alpha. After consulting with many different people in the business?I figured Alpha?s wouldn?t hold up to the power and torque these engines were making?so I decided?got to go Bravo!!

That was a HUGE decision?which meant that EVERYTHING related to power and propulsion changed. Not just for one engine but TWI N ENGINES/TWIN BRAVO upgrade!! Everything from the prop forward was new or near new. The cooling system had to be re ?engineered ?Bravo Drives have no water pump?so I decided to simplify things by going with crank mounted raw water pumps pulling through the drives. This saved a ton of time and money with brackets, hoses and pulleys for the traditional Mercruiser belt driven raw water pumps. This was a good decision and I must say the system works great!!

About this same time the steel trailer that I bought with the boat literally was falling apart. I was ?Sucking up the seat covers? every time I left the driveway. The day I saw one of my trailer wheels pass me going down the highway I decided to call Willie at All American and have him build a custom 10,200 GTWR twin torsion axle aluminum bunk trailer with 4: wheel disc brakes for this boat?.add $4500.

So now the hunt started for twin Bravo Transom Assemblies and Bravo I drives. Long story short?I got all of the stuff together in March of this year and started building everything. Once the motors were set up and running, Transom assemblies were in place?my team and I looked at the wiring in this 35 year old boat and decided ?RE WIRE EVERYTHING?. So the boat got new engine harnesses and new helm to bilge harnesses along with all new gauges and switch panels. A new sending unit was required for the tank to match the new fuel gauge. A new steering cable was required to match up with the new steering ram (now on the port motor). There was then no way to have an internal tiller tie bar so the drive tie bar is really ?THE TIE BAR?!!

I had along the way picked up a pair of McLeod Drop Out Bolsters from a 1992 Formula 292 SR-1 donor boat. I am slowly re working the cockpit and cabin with up grades.

This old Thunderbird Formula has literally been through a TOTAL MAKE OVER. It is a 1979 Formula Liberator hull being pushed through the water with a new modern propulsion system and new engines. The engines made 425 Horsepower at 5600 RPM on the dyno and we figure as installed we have close to 800 Horsepower in the water and 850 Ft Lbs of Torque.

So the question that gets asked all the time is ?How does it run??

Before the upgrade it struggled to get past 60 with no load. Now it will run 55-60 at 4500 RPM and pushes 75 GPS at 5400 RPM. This is with 23? Mirage props. It will run 27 MPH at 2000 RPM on plane!! This power package equals the Torque and produces 150 more total Horsepower than twin 330 horse 454?s will and weighs about 500 lbs less!! These engine are about 250 lbs lighter that the ones they replaced due to the difference in the exhaust manifolds. I have at this writing only put about 4-5 hours on it so I think it has room for improvement.

The question I ask my self is ?Was it worth it?? In smiles per mile and the rush of acceleration when I push the throttles forward?a definite yes. In terms of economic feasibility?probably not. Including the original purchase price and the trailer I am right at $30K in to it. After interior and electronics it will push $35K. Consider though?it?s basically a new boat mechanically and with good care the propulsion system could easily find a home within a year or two in say a powerless Formula 292 FasTech or something similar. If I bought a entry level sport boat that performs as well as this one does I would easily spend more than twice what I have in this one and loose half of that value in the first two years.

This project to me represents the core of the sport and serves as a reminder that anything can be done with good planning and attention to detail..

 

[sprink49]

Works for me.

On the last set of images sent out? It works for me on the previous ones posted, but it's impossible that the last links work for you as the links aren't stored in the comment correctly. This is what I get from the last post with images:

SeaSkip...help me figure this out...when I go back to the first page of this thread I see all of the images ...no problem.

To see them full size go to:
http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/...ormula-255-liberator-restoration-summary.html

and

http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/formula/269269-79-formula-255-liberator-update-27.html